Sick fish/Rams - need help

General
Where do you stay?Kraaifontein, Western Cape
How long have you been keeping tropical fishes?last 3 years but 7 years in total
How long has the tank been running before you added fish/this fish? over 2 years
What fish do you have in your Tank (type, number and size)? 3 whiptails, 5 rams, 2 bolivian rams, 3 firemouths, around 21 rainbows, 5 ancistrus, 11 corys (various), around 15 ottos, 6 torpedo barbs, 7 siamese foxes, 15 congo tetras (going to moved soon), 9 coolie loaches (somewhere), 5 clown loaches, 7 bloodfin tetras, 5 red danios, 7 blue danios and 9 tetras (black and elbino), 4 Cockatoo reds
When did you last buy any new fish? a month back from a private seller -bloodfin tetras
Which food are you feeding and how often do you feed? twice a day - morning and evening. Some of Proffs flakes and frozen food (every second day at evening), Tetra Prima, Omega One vegie rounds and shrimp pellets, Ocean Nutrition Spirulina flakes

Disease
Describe the problem that the fish is having (behaviour, breathing, excretion (droppings), food intake, colour)?So far only the rams, bolivian female and a pair of cockatoos are sick. Very thin, heavy breathing. Rams have needle like things haging from they "poop holes" and one german ram has something red hanging out with a red belly
Is the fish eating?Some of the sick fish are.
Has the problem occurred before?:nope
Have you treated the problem and how?Been using flagy tablets. Treated for 3 days, 30% water change and treated again for 3 days with a 30% water change yesterday again. Been mixing their food with Seachem polygaurd and seachem Nourish
Have you had any other problems in the past? Some problems with a rainbow with a "rotting" nose and some danios duying.
What were they? Think rainbow had TB but not to sure. Died a while back. Lost a few endlers but no idea why.
Did you treat for these problems? Yes
How?Treated the tank with Seachem Paragaurd as per instructions. Want to try Tramisol

Your aquarium & Maintenance
How big is the tank. (L x b x h)?240x60x60cm
How many litres of water?around 850
What type of filter do you run?canister filters, Tetratec EX1200 (x3) and an EX2400 (X1) with a UV 8W light
What is IN the filter?ceramics, bioballs and foam
How many litres per hour is the filter rated for?1200 and 2400 p/hour
How often do you clean your tank?weekly
How do you clean your tank? syphon gravel at sides and at front of tank
How much water do you take out for Water change?25 to 30% per week
Do you prepare your water for water changes? How and what do you add?kept in plastic drums and treated with Seachem Prime
What water do you use. (Tap, bore hole, RO)?Tap
What substrate do you have?silica sand with pebbles
What else is in the tank (Rocks, plants, fake plants, shells, anything else)?lots of plants, bogwood and a plastic ship (dont ask)

Water parameters in your aquarium
Describe the water (smell and colour)?smell like warm water, clear
Temperature of the water? 26 degrees
General hardness (GH)?
Carbonate hardness (KH)?
Ammonia:have not checked any perimeters as I have been doing a water changed every 4 days the last 2 weeks.
Nitrite (No2-)?
Nitrate (No3-)?
pH?
How did you test these? Have you checked the expiry date on the test kits?have a redsea kit

Lights
What light do you have? 2 sets of T5 - 108watts per pair
How long is the light on for?3.5 hours in the morning and 3.5 hours late afternoon
Do you have lots of plants in the tank (real or fake)?
How do you fertilize the plants?Seachem Flourish

If possible, can you post some pictures of
(1) The sick fish Will get some picks asap
(2) A close up of the sick fish, and/or effected area
(3) the full tank.

 

Post those pics - got a couple of ideas,but wan to see the "patients" first....

 

Morning. Tried to take a few yesterday, but too blurry. Lost a cockatoo this morning. One of the smaller rams has definately red "worms" hanging out, but the rest is hard to tell. He has a red stomach as well. Will try to get some decent photos after work.

Thanks

 

Hi Gregorian,

I think we need the pics please yes, but just some general comments:

From the water, filtration and tank side, I think all sounds ok. I think it is important that we know pH, because you have a heavy fish load and are obviously feeding quite heavily and then the pH tends to drop from the biological filtration. In general the drops kits are not accurate here in the Cape and the actual pH is actually much lower, as a matter of fact easily as low as 4. This has pretty drastic consequences, however, we first need an accurate reading before I can make a recommendation here.

As a general comment, I would also like to say that I would never keep dwarf cichlids such as Rams and cockatoos with fishes such as Bolivian rams and firemouths. The bigger cichlids just simply overwhelm the dwarfs and they are stressed all the time and they do not get enough food. Do this for a few weeks and I would not be surprised that you have all sorts of problems. I would just simply never recommend keeping these fishes together. You know that I keep many A aggasizzi dwarfs and these I always keep in small species tanks and have to really concentrate on the feeding. I also feed them regularly on freshly hatched brine shrimps. If you tried this in your tank, the dwarfs would not get a single shrimp because the other fishes would gobble up everything.

However, send us some pics so that we can see your fishes please and the pH measurement is important please.

KInd regards,

Dirk

 

Morning Professor. I will see if I cant borrow my brother in laws testing kit. His a fanatic on his water testing.

I have a firemouth that is a bit busy. I know he chases the one Bolivian ram but usualy not far. The bigger Fox chases him around again otherwise most fish dont "pest" each other. The Bolivion rams are quite shy and always keep to the bottom. The male is doing well, but the female has been hiding in the one corner. The rest of the rams are all over the place, but the sick ones are keeping to the back.

I will take some photos after work.

Thanks again professor.

Anton

 

Photo as requested.

 

I don't see any Rams?

 

Morning Professor. I cant get a clear picture of the rams, but this one has a red worm (just a single worm) hanging out say 6mm in leght. The other 2 has red "stomachs" with busy stuff hanging out, but white in color. Hope this helps.

 

OK I still cannot actually see this properly, but perhaps we can move on to the medication that you have been talking about.

The medication that some of us have been using to treat parasitic worms is levamisole which is a medication which is used for treating pidgeons, called Dovaworm, and is sold by Panorama. You are asking about Tramisol. I actually think this is a pidgeon medication for treatment of crop canker which is caused by flagellate organisms (yes, and anyone that thinks that they ask me about treating pidgeons as well had better not start getting ideas, I only know that they s..t on my roof). I think Tramisol contains Dimetridozole which is a compound related to metronidazole in other words, the same as Flagyl. Please check on the active ingredient of Tramisol. If it is what I think, then it will not work and you would need to get Dovaworm. This is a yellow fluid and you put it on your dried food before feeding. You can perhaps try this.

Kind regards,

Dirk

 

Dirk Tramisol is a 2.2% dilution of the same active ingredient which is in Dovaworm (6%)

 

Hi Henk,

Thanks for clarifying this. In this case, Anton, I would like to suggest that you use this for about a week and then you can tell us if you see any improvement. Dose all of your dried food before feeding. The frozen food does not absorb this properly and cannot be used. The problem may be that the fishes that are the worst infected will not eat properly any more and therefore will not actually get the medication into their bodies, but let us see how matters progress.

Kind regards,

Dirk

 

Dirk - i think the Tramisol dilution is a little weak and might not work with just a once a day feeding.

 

Hi Henk,

I agree that the due to the weak solution you may not have the wanted effect. If you add such a solution to the water pidgeons drink, then this is not a problem, but for lacing the fish food this may be a problem. However, I agree that more feedings per day would be required. My honest opinion is that if you pay so much money for the fishes you keep, then you should use high quality medications if you have a problem so that you can save them. To use cheap meds is false economy.

Kind regards,

Dirk

 

Thanks for all the help. Professor and Henk. I will pick up some hopefully after work today.

Thanks again

Anton

 

I couldn't agree more. The marine guys spend thousands on medications for fish. Trust me, I have been there. I can't see why we don't do the same for our freshwater fish? It always bugs me that we don't spend the money on proper medications. Although, it's often very difficult to diagnose the fish in the first place. If you go to the LFS, they are often useless and gie you stuff you wouldn't even need in the first place... It is not easy to come by a true diagnosis of your fish. But That is why the forum is here.

 

It's nice to have friends in the know. There is so many brands of medication out there so getting the right diagnose first and then deciding on which brand of medication to buy is difficult.

Any idea if it's worth making a list of diseases and what medication works? Atleast what is available locally.

It's nice to know Henk that "sells" Micro-lift (thanks Henk). The is some popular medication out there like Seachem and Heal All - not to sure about that. And of course professor that does not accept shortcuts to any answers he gives. It's probably the right way to do it anyway.

Any suggestions on a good/ reliable kits to test the water quality and what to buy. Which is better? Testing strips or "chemical kits".

Thanks again

Anton